The Down Range Forum
Member Section => Shotguns => Topic started by: Ping on October 10, 2011, 08:22:31 PM
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Carried Remingtons in the Air Force and currently own a 870 in 12 gauge and one in 20 gauge. Dependable and accurate. Normally keep the rifled barrels on for both hunting and personal defense.
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Great shotguns, I have 2 but being a lefty I use Mossbergs. The safety is the reason I use the Mossbergs or H & R single shots for hunting.
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I love my 870s. I kept one as a trap/pheasent gun the other I turned into a 'camp' shotgun with a first gen Spec Ops Blackhawk Knox stock and a Surefire dedicated forend(http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-qSZAsDoXqbM/TcIJ6NfviwI/AAAAAAAAAxA/JgEXQG1jYNA/s1600/0504111746.jpg) I have since added an extened mag tube
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Excellent setup Dakotaranger. The only perk I got on one of my 870's was Tru Glo sights. I kept everything else the same since I use it for both deer hunting and home defense.
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Excellent setup Dakotaranger. The only perk I got on one of my 870's was Tru Glo sights. I kept everything else the same since I use it for both deer hunting and home defense.
My Supermag 870 is such a great shooter I didn't want to mess it up, and the guys I go biking with one is 6 feet tall and I'm only 5'6" so length of pull is an issue. When you run 3 in 000 Buckshoot through it the recoil reduction is a really, really good thing to have.
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Nice rig Dakota. I'm with Bulldog though. They'd be near perfect if they put the safety on top where God intended it to be. :-\
FQ13
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Nice rig Dakota. I'm with Bulldog thought. they'd be near perfect if they put the safety on top where God intended it to be. :-\
FQ13
You know they make lefty 870s. Once you deprogram the 'reach under the trigger guard safety release' they work just fine.
With the Mossy I have to actually reprogram my brain for the safety all over again. (my usual hunting shotgun is a lefty 11-87) On the Mossy, I just leave the safety OFF and keep an empty chamber for beside use.
The new ones are express but there are a couple of LH Wingmaster Remmys on gunsamerica and an 11-87 lefty.
I've been toying with the idea to go the bulldog route and make the Wingmaster a fighting shotgun but with already having a short barrel Mossy, it's been on the back burner for years. I already have an extended mag tube and the BlackHawk stock. Those SureFire forends are pricey!
Bulldog, are the switches for the light on the forend ambi?
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IMHO, the trigger guard safety sucks regardless of which hand you use. The tang mounted safety is right there and can be used by lefties and righties alike. You just slide your thumb up. Plus, you just have to glance down to see if its engaged or not, without having to look sideways at the trigger guard. ::) I had one on my Browning BPS when I was a kid, and one on my my Mossy 590. Its not too different than the three position safety on my Ruger M77. For that matter my RWS has one too. Heck, even the AR safety can be used by a lefty. You just use the trigger finger rather than the thumb. A trigger guard safety is, in my opinion, a PITA. And like you, I leave it off on my current Maverick bedside shotty. As far as as I am concerned the gun has no safety. Its an empty chamber and once racked its a matter of keeping your finger off the bang switch. I really would prefer the top mounted safety though.
FQ13
PS As far as the forends, they are ambi. Just like the AR only in reverse. If you are RH, you trigger them with your thumb. LH, use your index finger.
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It wasn't too bad getting it from Ebay. NIB. Since the intented use is because of mt lions I wanted something that would be usuable for everyone that's not overly trained in shooting, especially at night half asleep heading to the outhouse. Besides single might as well build what I wanted.
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IMHO, the trigger guard safety sucks regardless of which hand you use. The tang mounted safety is right there and can be used by lefties and righties alike. You just slide your thumb up. Plus, you just have to glance down to see if its engaged or not, without having to look sideways at the trigger guard. ::) I had one on my Browning BPS when I was a kid, and one on my my Mossy 590. Its not too different than the three position safety on my Ruger M77. For that matter my RWS has one too. Heck, even the AR safety can be used by a lefty. You just use the trigger finger rather than the thumb. A trigger guard safety is, in my opinion, a PITA. And like you, I leave it off on my current Maverick bedside shotty. As far as as I am concerned the gun has no safety. Its an empty chamber and once racked its a matter of keeping your finger off the bang switch. I really would prefer the top mounted safety though.
FQ13
PS As far as the forends, they are ambi. Just like the AR only in reverse. If you are RH, you trigger them with your thumb. LH, use your index finger.
FQ, try using a tang safety with a stock with a pistol grip and then tell me it's "right there" ... you just have to loosen your grip, move your thumb from the bottom and around the grip up to the top of the stock to flip the safety, then back into position again.
hmmm...you are using your thumb, right?
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Tang safety with a top folding stock is unusable.
I'm another who doesn't bother with it, "safe" is an empty chamber.
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If you put a Vang oversized safety button on an 870 or 1100 you can easily hit the button as you put your finger on the trigger. http://www.shop.vangcomp.net/product.sc;jsessionid=8E6834D1F0646F44677753E4BE38CAB3.qscstrfrnt01?productId=27&categoryId=7
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Personally I too like the controls on the Mossy 500 better. Both guns are "bullet proof" so it comes down to these type of things.
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JIMO, I never use the safety on a pump gun. Its either loaded, or empty chamber.
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Heck, even the AR safety can be used by a lefty. You just use the trigger finger rather than the thumb.
That's how I started using the safety on my first AR. I have an ambi on the newer one and almost never use it "proper" way. I keep forgetting that it's there.
PS As far as the forends, they are ambi. Just like the AR only in reverse. If you are RH, you trigger them with your thumb. LH, use your index finger.
Gotcha.
FQ, try using a tang safety with a stock with a pistol grip and then tell me it's "right there"
hmmm...you are using your thumb, right?
I hadn't thought of the pistol grip addition with a Mossy, thanks for bringing that up.
As for the last sentence, I don't want to know....*fingers in ears* ...na na na na na na :P
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I leave the chamber empty. Psychological effect with chambering a round, though it is a position giveaway, may cause Mr. Badguy to depart the immediate area.
The only time that there is a round in my 870's chamber is while deer hunting (Just a week and a half away. ;D). I keep the safety on until I see deer in range.
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Empty Chamber, is safe.
(http://i296.photobucket.com/albums/mm182/twyacht/870access2001.jpg)
(http://i296.photobucket.com/albums/mm182/twyacht/870access001.jpg)
Just a collapsible ATI stock, and a CDNN rail for a light. That's it. May consider some type of iron sights, but than I think to myself,
Really? WTF for? ;)
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You guys are going to force me to post pics of my 42 year old Wingmaster, with an American Walnut stock, in nearly perfect condition aren't you? As soon as I get it back, I will....
It ain't tacticool but it's flawless and dependable.... ;)
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This thread made me take a peek for a short barrel for my 11-87 LH.
Got one off gunbroker today for $140.
21" w/rifle sights. It should ship on Monday. ;D
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This thread made me take a peek for a short barrel for my 11-87 LH.
Got one off gunbroker today for $140.
21" w/rifle sights. It should ship on Monday. ;D
We're a bad influence ;D
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my house gun is a plain jane express, with wood stock and Choate plastic fore grip...vent rib shortened to 18" and threaded for choke tubes... Rem factory mag tube, loaded one down, with Choate side saddle... SureFire weapons light... I shoot a couple of local 3 gun matches a year to remember to move the front thing back and forth
for Ft Benning last year, helped a friend (good Cowboy Action Shooter) modify an 870 as he didn't want to shoot a lot of slugs through his 1897....21" rifle sight slug barrel... added a pistol grip stock, and opened the ejection port to facilitate over the top single loading... side saddle..shot it well in the house clearing (22 slugs)
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Love the Wingmaster also. I own two Remington 870's. One in 12 and one in 20. Only regret is I wish both were in 12 gauge and both had synthetic stocks. The 20 has wood. Pretty, but while in the field I cringe when my boy is going through brush with it. I know I should let it slide as it gives character with the scratches, but I still like keeping the shotguns nice.
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Hi from a new member (jumping from USCCA). I have a Remington 870 Express and wonder if the Spec Ops Blackhawk Knox stock is a worthwhile addition. Incidentally, I keep an empty chamber for saftey too.
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Hi from a new member (jumping from USCCA). I have a Remington 870 Express and wonder if the Spec Ops Blackhawk Knox stock is a worthwhile addition. Incidentally, I keep an empty chamber for saftey too.
I have the Knoxx stock on my 870 and recommend it totally.
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Good question and answer cause I have been wondering that myself. Absolutely love every Blackhawk accessory I have ever purchased.
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I have the Knoxx stock on my 870 and recommend it totally.
I've got it on two 870s well worth it for Turkey and SD
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I would nor recommend the 1st Gen Knoxx stock but I highly recommend the Gen 2!!!
Sent from my Nexus S 4G using Tapatalk
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I have a Remington 870 Wingmaster myself and I thought about converting it to a Tactical home defense Shotgun because I don't use it for hunting. I hunt with my Bear Bow and my Remington 770 7mm Rem Mag. I found myself using the 870 for home defense a while back and I must say that it is a handy dandy thing when you cock that sucker and the assailant hears that distinctive sound, music to my ears. The dude actually peed his pants when he heard it and saw me with it aiming at his gut. Well, I did have to have the carpet cleaned but the police appreciated that I didn't fill his gut full of shot. I just hope the fool doesn't sue me for a clean pair of undies. Is it a good idea to convert it to a Tactical Shotgun or should I just purchase a new one for that purpose? I saw an ad for an MKA 1919 Shotgun that looks like and AR and is a Semi automatic Shotgun for $699 at Arms Of America, LLC. Not bad but then again I love the action on my 870. I mean I would have peed my pants too if someone had cocked a gun like that and pointed it at me. I love the pics you guys posted of your shotguns keep'm coming.
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If you don't use it for anything else I would go ahead and convert it to Home defense.
Personally I would buy an 18 1/2 inch barrel, Tritium/ Fiber optic bead and adjustable stock.
You might want a fore end that mounts a light but that's a personal preference issue.
http://www.brownells.com/.aspx/pid=26926/Product/BARREL-18-POLICE-W-RIFLE-SIGHTS-PARKERIZED-IMP-CYL
http://www.brownells.com/.aspx/pid=41697/avs|Make~~Model_1=Remington__870/Product/SHOTGUN-SIGHT-SET
http://www.brownells.com/.aspx/pid=27522/avs|Make~~Model_1=Remington__870/Product/REM-870-MOSSBERG-500-535-590-INTRAFUSE-T6-STOCK-SET
Midway offers the same items.
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I have a Remington 870 Wingmaster myself and I thought about converting it to a Tactical home defense Shotgun because I don't use it for hunting..........Is it a good idea to convert it to a Tactical Shotgun or should I just purchase a new one for that purpose?
I wouldn't chop up a Wingmaster for a self defense gun. A lot of what you pay for in a Wingmaster is the high gloss Walnut, along with the high polished bluing. Also, bear in mind not all 870's are the same. There is a lot of difference between them. If you want a really nice, dependable self defense 870, go with one of the Police models. They have much better parts and are finished to a higher degree. Here are some of the differences between the Express, Wingmaster, and the Police Models.
The Express is Remington's "budget" gun, made to compete with the cheaper to make Winchester and Mossberg guns.
The Wingmaster is Remington "Cadillac" top-of-the-line sporting gun.
The Police is a Wingmaster with a dull finish and is a much more carefully inspected and built gun.
How Remington lowered the Express price was to reduce hand labor to a bare minimum, and to eliminate much of the polishing and deburring the better quality Wingmaster and Police guns get.
The Express is basically the same milled steel receiver and heavy-duty internals gun the better 870's are, just in a rougher, less well finished form with plastic and MIM parts.
The Express Model has:
A plastic trigger group.
The dimples in the mag tube and the new style plastic magazine retention system, EXCEPT on the extended magazine version, which does NOT have the dimples.
A rougher finish inside and outside, with machine marks and some burrs left.
A rougher, bead blasted blue job.
A less polished bore.
A two piece barrel. (not 100% sure about this)
Hardwood or synthetic stock, with a sporting-length fore end and pressed-in checkering.
The Defense version has 18", Cylinder bore barrel, with a bead sight.
Some Metal Injection Molded (MIM) parts, like the extractor.
Has the locking safety button.
The Wingmaster has:
An aluminum trigger group.
The old style magazine retention system.
A much smoother finish inside and out, no machine marks or burrs.
The Wingmaster gun receives a higher level of inspection and finishing.
A fine, commercial polished blue finish.
A polished bore.
A one piece barrel.
A chrome plated bolt.
Walnut stocks with the famous "Bowling Pin" finish in gloss or satin and better checkering.
Wide choices in barrel lengths and choke options.
No use of MIM parts, the extractor is milled.
The Wingmaster is the full top-of-the-line commercial Remington pump gun, and is priced accordingly.
The 870 Police has:
An aluminum trigger group.
The old style magazine retention system.
A much smoother finish inside and out, no machine marks or burrs.
The Police gun receives a higher level of inspection and finishing.
A military-grade parkerized finish.
A polished bore.
A one piece barrel.
Walnut or synthetic stock, with a short police-length fore end.
The Remington “R3” super recoil pad that reduced felt recoil by 30%.
Choices in different stocks, including Speedfeed, and others.
18" to 20" improved cylinder barrel, with a wide choice in sights, including rifle, ghost ring, and luminous.
Police options like magazine extenders, forearms with built-in lights, and sling swivels.
Heavy-duty magazine spring.
Heavy-duty trigger-sear spring.
Sling swivel mounts.
No use of MIM parts, the extractor is milled.
The Express is a "bottom of the line" budget gun, the Wingmaster is a "top of the line" sporting gun, the Police is the top-of-the-line in defense guns.
The 870's are generally considered to be the finest quality pump gun made.
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Another advantage of the Police version is it has what is called a flexi tab, in the instance you have a shell latch failure and a shell is allowed into the area above the shell carrier, it will go ahead and feed it, not so with the field guns. That is the main reason the Police guns are 100 to 125.00 more for what appears to be an express.
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Honestly, I've not made many "bad" firearm purchase decisions, but, somehow, I feel foolish for not verifying all of them with the folks on this forum ahead of time.
The combined knowledge and willingness to "teach" by it's members are most impressive.
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Honestly, I've not made many "bad" firearm purchase decisions, but, somehow, I feel foolish for not verifying all of them with the folks on this forum ahead of time.
The combined knowledge and willingness to "teach" by it's members are most impressive.
I have to admit I have .
Most notably a S&W 669, and a Walther P - 38, nothing about the guns, just the try before you buy.
Once I got a chance to shoot them I HATED them.
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The Wingmasters I carried at Aviano Air Base, Italy had the black matte finish. They were really nice and functioned like clockwork. The 870's I have now are newer but not quite as smooth. Still love shooting them and know they are going to work no matter what.
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My dad just inherited a basically NIB 870 Express with hard case and 2/3 box of shells (sadly, due to my mom's uncle, who has Alzheimer's).
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I just inherited my Grandpa's 870 Wingmaster in.... wait for it.... 16 Guage ;D It needs some clean-up and probably a good cleaning which it will get this weekend. I also got his Remington 511 Scoremaster 22 short/long/long rifle which is rougher yet and missing the Williams Peep sight it had on it last time I saw it, need to make some calls :). The 22 has some issues one is the stock's finish is aobut 40% and the other is with the trigger, the pull is horrible and the bolt cams up when its pulled so I have a little work to do tomorrow after church. Not sure what to do about the stock-refinish, replace or just leave it? Grandpa would probably love to see his grandson breathe some life back into it...
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I kinda like the 16 gauge but the supply of factory loads is limited.
Enjoy Magoo!
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I am kind of addicted to 16 ga.
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I am kind of addicted to 16 ga.
I'd never thought much about it until my landlord had me stash her guns in the attic of the house I was renting. Her son was a bit of a drunken dumbass. Included in that stash of guns was a mid 40's o 50's Belgian FN, Browning Sweet 16! A real beauty too! Didn't look like it had been shot much and she was more than happy for me to clean it up and have my way with it! I fell for that gun and offered her a decent price for it but alas, she had an extensive local family and I missed out!
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The whole reason for the 16 was to have more power then a 20 offered, but would still point and swing better then a 12 ga. which were big heavy pigs until about 50 to 60 years ago.
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Another advantage of the Police version is it has what is called a flexi tab, in the instance you have a shell latch failure and a shell is allowed into the area above the shell carrier, it will go ahead and feed it, not so with the field guns. That is the main reason the Police guns are 100 to 125.00 more for what appears to be an express.
M25, I have an 870 Tactical which has the door buster choke and a rail on top for optics, is this a "Police Version" as well or is this something completely different?
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Timothy, ordered 16 guage shells for my father last year. Not cheap and bought in bulk from either Midway USA or Cheaper than Dirt. Also got him a nice recoil pad.
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So as I have been saying, with the inability to build my new AR due to outrageous prices and the backorder situation. I thought now would be the time to do a little work to Ye old 870. As of today it is at the trusty smithy getting a picatinny rail and a new Eotech forend.
I bought it used a few years ago when the Highway Patrol traded them for AR's. It's a Remmington 870 Police Magnum. It came with a Speedfeed stock and plenty of character. First thing I did when I got it was to take it apart and clean the dickens out of it. Then it occupied the darkest corner of my safe till now.
In the last week it has gotten a new Knoxx stock, the barrel refinished. The action polished, a speed dot, a side saddle, and as I said earlier, it's at the gunsmith for picatinney rail and install the new forend. Yea, I know I could do the forend, but I don't have the wrench and it was cheaper to have him do it than buy the stupid tool. That I would use maybe twice in my life. I should have it back next week. Will post porn.
Basically I wanted to turn this into my primary home defense gun. I live closer to my neighbors than I would like, so over penetration is something I think about. I avoid buckshot, instead as an indoor load I like a heavy birdshot. At across the room range I'm not too worried about spread, and I really have no concerns of hitting the neighbors. (Even if there ARE a couple I wouldn't mind hitting, perhaps with a shovel?)
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I've got two 870s in the house. My son has a Youth 20ga but had a full length stock now that he's 6'3". My other is a used 870 Wingmaster Magnum that my father bought me just before he pasted. It originally belonged to the San Antonio PD with 18" cyl bore and +3 Rem extension. Later got a 20" rifle sighted cyl bore bbl for it. Recently swapped the oiled walnut stock for a synthethic stock that I've painted and now use a Mossy Oak pattern 21" Rem Choked bbl with fiber optic rifle sights. Just carried it up in Alaska after grouse and hares. Got turkey season coming up so time to switch chokes to the Xtra Full turkey.
(http://i71.servimg.com/u/f71/16/48/54/01/hardwa10.jpg) (http://www.servimg.com/image_preview.php?i=1010&u=16485401)
My all time favorite is a 870 MCS that I've used in Iraq and Afghanistan. Remington needs to sell these to us with a SBS stamp (has 18", 14" and 10" bbls).
(http://i28.servimg.com/u/f28/16/48/54/01/mcs_0110.jpg) (http://www.servimg.com/image_preview.php?i=10&u=16485401)
CD
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Must be nice....
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My all time favorite is a 870 MCS that I've used in Iraq and Afghanistan. Remington needs to sell these to us with a SBS stamp (has 18", 14" and 10" bbls).
CD
That can't be true. In 1934 short barreled shotguns were restricted to citizens because they served no military purpose. :P
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That can't be true. In 1934 short barreled shotguns were restricted to citizens because they served no military purpose. :P
Nope none at all. Unless, you know, you're actually in the military.
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So what kind of side saddle do most of you guys & gals run? I've heard the cheap ones work just not for long.
Slings? I've seen the bandoleer type (not a fan) and the inexpensive versions, any comments on slings? VTAC's slings are the way to go IMHO but kinda spendy.
As for stocks I've seen the Knox stocks mentioned here as well as Speed stocks, anyone have any experiences with other stocks? Good, bad or indifferent?
Sights are the most important consideration for me because all I've ever had on my shotguns are a bead, but I've played enough MW3 to know that ghost rings with tritium look cool ;D. Any suggestions on which manufacturer to go with? In my research they all look to come from the same place with different logos.
I know I ruined the thread drift I'm sorry. ;D
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I just use an el cheapo elastic nylon side saddle that goes on the stock. It works great, and every cop in the world carried one until some bright spark came up with the high dollar models that require installation. Spend the ten bucks and try one before dropping more cash.
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That can't be true. In 1934 short barreled shotguns were restricted to citizens because they served no military purpose. :P
Actualy the decision was made because Miller was dead and no one showed up to argue his side.
So no one ever said they actually did have military use.
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Actualy the decision was made because Miller was dead and no one showed up to argue his side.
So no one ever said they actually did have military use.
Thanks, Tom.
I did not know that bit of history.
I had assumed they were being stupid in the face of evidence. I learned they were being stupid in the absence of evidence.